From Chaos to Clarity: New Year's Resolutions

[00:00:00] Speaker A: Foreign. [00:00:16] Speaker B: Welcome to the but why Podcast, where we explore the human experience through a psychological lens by asking, but why? I'm Dr. Kristin. [00:00:24] Speaker A: And I'm Dr. Laura. And today we're exploring. What are we exploring? Oh, New Year's resolutions, Goal setting. [00:00:34] Speaker B: Goal setting. But it's our holiday party. [00:00:37] Speaker A: Is that right now? Yeah. Yeah. [00:00:42] Speaker B: I don't know if that exactly written out exactly right now. [00:00:47] Speaker A: Okay, sorry, sorry, sorry. Wait, wait. We're exploring our holiday party. Okay, so it's a bit of a different episode. So. So we're having a holiday party, and it's in two parts, which I'm now just processing. But we're. This is because we're celebrating 10 episodes, so we made it to double figures. But why? But in true British fashion, we're also taking any excuse to have a drink or a party over the holiday. [00:01:20] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:01:21] Speaker A: It is Christmas, and we didn't actually have to leave our houses for this party, so. So that makes it even better. So for part one, this is kind of what I said before, but for part one, we are specifically kind of focusing in on New Year's resolutions or kind of goal setting. So we know we're a little bit of a. We've got how many weeks? Few weeks until New Year's. But it can be useful to start thinking about goal setting now and how we make effective goals. [00:01:54] Speaker B: Yes. Yeah. So we'll definitely chat through all that. It might be a little bit more of a chaotic episode. Just, we already have the vibe of the holiday spirit, apparently. [00:02:05] Speaker A: I feel like I just made it chaotic anyway to start with. [00:02:09] Speaker B: I was like, wait, what's going on? That's what I mean. [00:02:11] Speaker A: It's like. [00:02:12] Speaker B: It's perfect. But we haven't even had a single drink yet. And so this is just our natural holiday season vibe. But, yeah, it's episode 10 should. [00:02:19] Speaker A: Oh. [00:02:19] Speaker B: What? You raised your hands like you were crying. [00:02:21] Speaker A: I was gonna say, I feel like when we start drinking, we'll actually become more streamlined, probably. [00:02:27] Speaker B: That happens to me a lot. Yeah. At least I think so in my head. On that note, should we cheers to 10 episodes. [00:02:37] Speaker A: Oh, my gosh. Yes. Okay, so you're not just having a drink now. How do we do this? [00:02:41] Speaker B: Oh, my gosh. [00:02:41] Speaker A: You can do a glass. [00:02:42] Speaker B: Oh, I have. Love a theme. [00:02:44] Speaker A: I have dinosaurs. Oh, my gosh. They're like. It does look a bit. They're like, different. [00:02:50] Speaker B: Oh, I love that. Oh, my God. Jack would love that. [00:02:53] Speaker A: This is like a proper goblet. [00:02:55] Speaker B: Awesome. Yeah. Mine has, like, stars all over it. You can see in the background, my Lumi light. It's so dark outside my window. My office lighting isn't great. So I now have my Lumi light that I use for my seasonal depression lighting me up. [00:03:11] Speaker A: That is such a good idea. I've got this. I don't know what it is. Some sort of, like, bed. Don't. Never really feel it. Does much. But anyway, anyway. [00:03:19] Speaker B: Cheers. Well, we're already on a change. I'm just really hoping the software that we use takes away the sipping sounds. [00:03:31] Speaker A: Oh, yeah. So, you know what is funny? Well, it's kind of funny. So I was also like, you know what you need at a party? A snack. So I was like, I'm gonna get a snack. But I brought. I got the worst snack. So I decided to get popcorn because I thought, that's a very party snack. [00:03:48] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:03:48] Speaker A: And then I was like, wait, we're recording. I cannot eat this whilst record because it's going to make so much noise. So now I just have a bowl of popcorn sat next to me, which I'm like, I can't really eat that yet. [00:03:57] Speaker B: That feels really unfair. I mean, while I'm going on and on about goals, you can just be sitting and then it'll look like you're really interested. I'll put myself on mute and just keep popping food into your mouth. I'm really jealous. I just, like, I made cookies over the weekend and I just shoved a cookie in my mouth on my way over while Thorin was running away and I was carrying my drink and he was sprinting away. I'm just like, yeah, it's very chaotic. [00:04:22] Speaker A: That sounds great. Yeah, I love it. A cookie on the run. [00:04:25] Speaker B: A cookie on the run. Oh, and other news. I got a new tattoo. No, you didn't. [00:04:31] Speaker A: Tell me. [00:04:32] Speaker B: I know I didn't. I'm going to be a surprise. I don't know. [00:04:34] Speaker A: Okay. Okay. Oh, my. [00:04:35] Speaker B: Here's my Christmas sweater. It says, slay the Patriarchy. I love it on it with unicorns. [00:04:40] Speaker A: This is the closest thing I got to Christmas, which is like a pagan ritual type. [00:04:45] Speaker B: I love it. That's amazing. I have one that says, summon the Christmas spirit with a bunch of witches going around a fire. And I also have a separate one for part two that I think you'll really appreciate. I have an outfit change. [00:04:56] Speaker A: Oh, amazing. Costume change. [00:04:58] Speaker B: Here's my tattoo. I just got it. [00:05:02] Speaker A: Oh, I remember you showing me the pictures ages ago. Oh, that's so cool. [00:05:08] Speaker B: I love it. [00:05:09] Speaker A: Oh, it's so. Did you go to the person you usually go to? [00:05:12] Speaker B: Yeah. Shout out to Kat at this mortal coil and altering him. She is amazing. So, yeah, it's great. Yeah. It only took her like an hour. She's just so fast. [00:05:22] Speaker A: Really? [00:05:23] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:05:23] Speaker A: I'm super tempted to go to her if I get another one, you know. [00:05:26] Speaker B: I also think she is. [00:05:28] Speaker A: She is at, like, I don't know, some sort of tattoo exhibition in Liverpool. And I was like, oh, maybe I should see if I can get with her there. [00:05:37] Speaker B: I've always wanted to go. [00:05:38] Speaker A: I don't even know what I'd want. [00:05:39] Speaker B: Yeah, well, that's the thing is, like, I kind of want to go to one of those, but I'm like, I'm going to end up with something super random. Yeah, but you should. Totally should, because she has some really cool stuff already drawn up that she'll have, like, on the wall and stuff like that. So she has, like, cool, like, daggers and stuff like that. [00:05:56] Speaker A: Yeah. I need to start planning what I want to get next, but I'm just sitting with my dragon. [00:06:00] Speaker B: Yeah. I mean, that was quite recent. So. Yeah. And other other news. Laura just turned 30. [00:06:09] Speaker A: Yay. I'm now officially old. [00:06:14] Speaker B: Definitely not. I mean, well, your week, your. Your week has also been like, I'm at a spa. I'm having a great time to, like, work days from hell. So, like, I can understand how your body's probably like, well, this is it. [00:06:30] Speaker A: Yeah. Like, what's going on? Like, are we relaxing or are we working? Yeah, but it's. Yeah, I feel like, oh, what did I do the other week? Oh, I went to get my hair cut and I told my hairdresser and she was like, she was so excited. She was like, 30 is the best age to be. And I was like, okay, I think. [00:06:50] Speaker B: 30S is better now that I've kind of wrapped my head around it, because my 30th birthday was two weeks before COVID started and I literally spent basically my first two years of my 30s. I'm 34 now. So first two years in my 30s feeling like I hadn't turned 30 yet. And, like, inside, which, I mean, I prefer being inside, but I like to choose inside. Yeah. The autonomy aspect. And so, like, now I'm actually like, I think you just stop caring in a good way. You're like, just don't care about what people think so much and you get more money to spend on random shit. Like. Yeah, exactly. [00:07:31] Speaker A: So. [00:07:31] Speaker B: Yeah. How do you feel? [00:07:33] Speaker A: I think I. I think I feel like. You know what? I feel like people have already been putting me in the 30s category. Like, anyway. And I think most of my friends are like, 30 already, so I kind of just felt like I was as well. So it doesn't feel like that bad. I think it was worse. I felt like it was worse when I turned 25, that I felt terrible when I turned 25, but 30, actually, I'm like, yeah, I should probably be here now. That's fine. [00:08:00] Speaker B: This feels right. Were you like me when you were a kid? Like, oh, she's such an old sleep soul. Like that. Were you that kid? Yeah, yeah. [00:08:09] Speaker A: Yep, definitely. But now I'm still a child, so it's like, well, that's the. [00:08:14] Speaker B: It just stays the same. You go from being an old soul to. Wow. She still collects Pokemon cards. [00:08:21] Speaker A: Oh, my gosh. Yeah. You need to see my desk. It's just littered with random things. Ewoks and dragons. [00:08:28] Speaker B: That's amazing. That's. I've got a little Sailor Moon miniature right in front of me. I just got some Sailor Moon cards and I can't decide if I want to hang them on my wall here for decoration for, like, the camera, because they're really pretty, or have them right in front of me for me, because they're really pretty. And I just can't. Can't choose. And I just. [00:08:49] Speaker A: It's always a tough pull. [00:08:50] Speaker B: Yeah. I got a sparkly Sailor Mars and I'm real thrilled about it, and I've put some on my list for my stocking this year. [00:08:57] Speaker A: Well, that's exciting. [00:08:58] Speaker B: Oh, my gosh. [00:08:59] Speaker A: I got Barda lego. [00:09:03] Speaker B: Oh, my God. [00:09:04] Speaker A: I haven't opened it yet. [00:09:05] Speaker B: Are you gonna build it this weekend? [00:09:08] Speaker A: I don't know. I might open it and start, but I'm also very aware of the organization that's going to be required, so I don't lose any pieces, so I might have to start. I. I tend to, like, or when you have a really big Lego piece, like, organize it out into separate Tupperware boxes, because I just end up losing them. Especially if it takes you a while to do it. Like, unless I had, like, a week of pure focus to build it, things are going to get lost. [00:09:35] Speaker B: Yeah. I think that's what puts me off of ever doing lego. I think I've had, like, one or two sets and just the, like, transition to actually knowing, like, from knowing that it's going to take all this time and focus and, like, getting that, like, it's so not intimidating in, like, a scary way, but, like, just like, it's like that hurdle that I can't quite overcome, but with other stuff I'm fine doing it. You know, whether it's like that I know is going to be time consuming, but I guess I just not be enough of my special interest to do. It's just other stuff that I do. [00:10:06] Speaker A: Yeah, I love make, like, making things, especially when there's just very clear instructions about how I do it. I really like that. [00:10:16] Speaker B: Yeah, that's me. When I see, like, if I have, like, a book comes in the mail and I didn't realize how big it was going to be, and it's just like, giant. I'm like, amazing. I get to, like, that's how I feel about those kinds of books. Like, I don't care if it takes a bit longer. So I get through, like, because you get. You have the time to fully get immersed in that world. And that's what I like about that. [00:10:37] Speaker A: Yeah. You know what else I got for my birthday? I got a Kindle. [00:10:42] Speaker B: Oh, welcome to the club. [00:10:45] Speaker A: I know. Do you have a Kindle? [00:10:47] Speaker B: I have a Kindle. I was really against them for a while because I just. I love collecting things so much, clearly. And books are, like, my special interest. And also I love the smell and the feel of reading a book. And, like, when you're finished, you close it and you just put it away and it's just, like, really nice. But I will say it makes it easier to read at night. You can. Mine's waterproof, so I don't worry about it, like, on a holiday and stuff like that. And I. I don't have this, actually. Maybe I should put it on my Christmas wish list. My cousin Katie. Shout out Katie. She has this, like, Kindle device that you can get on Amazon and you can attach it to your bed and then you, like. [00:11:28] Speaker A: I knew you were gonna save it. [00:11:29] Speaker B: You know me too well. Like, how can we move less while we're reading? You, like, attach it and then put it, like, wherever you are. But really, like, you could just be laying in your bed and have it above you, but it comes with a remote, so you can just turn the page. [00:11:43] Speaker A: I've seen this on Instagram. And I was like, oh, my gosh, that looks like the life. And the video I saw there was this woman and she was, like, totally covered in her duvet and obviously had her hands, like, just underneath and was just clicking through the book, like, reading it. And I was like, that looks like the dream. [00:12:00] Speaker B: It is. That's literally how I'm pretty sure my cousin sent me a picture of her using it. Just, like, cuddled up, mug of tea. Next to her if she felt like reaching out of the covers, but she was all wrapped up. It's necessary. Okay. I need to remember. You need to text me after to remind me to put this on my Christmas list. Or Jack, if you're listening. [00:12:21] Speaker A: Yeah. Oh, also, shout out. Kristen bought me these really cool candles. [00:12:26] Speaker B: Oh, I love your candle modeling. [00:12:28] Speaker A: If you're watching the video, you can. Yeah. See my candle modeling, which smells so good. And this one says, happy birthday, you magical creature. [00:12:35] Speaker B: I knew you were gonna light that one first. [00:12:38] Speaker A: Yeah. Have fun. [00:12:40] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:12:40] Speaker A: So, yeah. Thanks, Kristen. [00:12:41] Speaker B: You're welcome. I love a good candle. We're. We're on candle explosion watch as well, so just in case, I'm gonna make sure that your candle doesn't burn down. [00:12:53] Speaker A: There are a number of books near the candle, so who knows what will happen? But I'm sure it'll be okay. [00:12:59] Speaker B: I'm sure it'll be fine. I'll let you know if your dresser starts on fire. [00:13:04] Speaker A: Perfect. Thank you. [00:13:06] Speaker B: Oh, man. Well, also, guys, our next episode will probably be like this the whole time, because this is our, like, let's. Let's be smart about it episode. And the next episode is part two of our Christmas party, at which point we're just gonna talk about some really random stuff. So if you like this part, then you'll be thrilled for our next episode. If you like the next part where we actually talk about theory and stuff, then, well, you got. You can deal with it. [00:13:36] Speaker A: Yeah, you don't have to. You don't have to listen to the next one, you know, but still. [00:13:40] Speaker B: Download it. Yeah, I don't care if you listen. Just download it. Okay. Well, with that in mind, should we get into New Year's resolutions? [00:13:54] Speaker A: Yes. It feels super weird to be thinking about the new year. [00:13:58] Speaker B: It's freaky. Like, how I know that time is relative. Okay. I understand that as you get older, your years seem shorter. I understand that. But I also think that our time concept. Our concept of time has completely changed since COVID and I don't really understand. And there is some research supporting this as well. I didn't pull it up because I didn't know if I was going to say this, but there's definitely. There's already research. [00:14:24] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:14:25] Speaker B: Here we are. There's research already out there saying that, like, the. The lockdowns completely messed with our sense of time, because how we. How we live our lives was completely changed, and our brains are in kind of, like, relaxed mode when we're in our usual routines, when we're Kind of like on that low cortisol levels, whereas when our. We were constantly looking back to like, when's the next lockdown? Or when do we get to see this person? Or when do I get my next j. We completely changed how we operated within our lives for about a year and a half. Um, and that's one of the many reasons. I'm sure there's loads of reasons. I, I also, I also think it's just because people missed out on major life events and completely changed who they were seeing and when and why and learned how to reprioritize how they spent their time. But yeah. So long story short, this year has flown by in parts and also some days have seemed so long. [00:15:25] Speaker A: Yeah. Yeah. And how do you think, like with COVID do you think it's made things slow down or speed? Like, how do you think it's kind of changed our perception of time? [00:15:34] Speaker B: I think time feels like it's going faster, but also that we don't understand that it's going to be 2025 soon. I think a lot of us feel like it shouldn't be. I feel like it's still 2021. Thank goodness it's not. But I feel like, okay, maybe 2022, maybe we're going into 2023. That's kind of what I feel like. And everyone I talk to is like, yeah, it doesn't feel like we should be 5 years post the first Covid in like January, February. [00:16:02] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:16:03] Speaker B: You know what? [00:16:03] Speaker A: I have no idea where I feel I should be. I really don't know. [00:16:08] Speaker B: You operate in your own time, Laura. [00:16:10] Speaker A: Yeah, I'm like, I'll just take what you give me. 2025. Okay, that's fine. [00:16:15] Speaker B: Yeah. I don't know, maybe even for you this year was. Maybe the time emphasis was more placed on your 30th than like the passing of time. Maybe. [00:16:26] Speaker A: Yeah. Yeah. I also feel like this year has been like one of my busiest years because it's the year that I started working properly, like in academia and is arguably like the first like real job, like normal person job that I've had aside from like doing like sports psychology consultancy work and things which are like, they are jealous, but you know what I mean? It's not like nine to five, like you go to the office, like you have like, there's a proper structure, organizational structure and system and a manager you report to and things. Whereas like working in like football clubs and like tennis academies, it's a bit more chaotic. Yeah, chaotic. So I think for me that's made things feel very, very busy, I think, and very full on. Like, trying to adapt to a quote unquote, like normal, like, I guess, kind of 9 to 5 job. [00:17:27] Speaker B: And I'd hardly say that academia is normal or nine to five. [00:17:31] Speaker A: Oh, yeah, it's like eight till eight. [00:17:36] Speaker B: Yeah. With very abnormal. It's. It's a weird positive because we're both in academia. There's a reason we enjoy it. It's a positive culture, but it's a weird culture that has very specific demands. So it's. You're not just adapting to, like, a different type of work, you're adapting to a different type of work. [00:17:59] Speaker A: Yeah, definitely. So I think for me, yeah, that's why this year's maybe felt quite. Yeah, I think quite quick, but I think also almost like a bit of a step up. [00:18:13] Speaker B: Would you say that you accomplished a goal? [00:18:16] Speaker A: Have I accomplished a goal? I mean, I must have because you said it was a. I must have. [00:18:22] Speaker B: Done something because you said it was a step up. So if that. Was that a goal. [00:18:28] Speaker A: You know what I think it is? This is maybe a very strange and unstructured goal, but I feel like I've met a goal of. I don't know how to word it about, like, almost having a bit more confidence in myself. So I think going into what I perceive as more of, like a real job has given me more confidence in that. Like I know what I'm talking about or I can do a certain role. So I think there's some sort of goal inside that, which is around. Yeah, I guess building. Building a bit of confidence or at least seeing myself as not, like, lesser than other people. Because I think when I initially started, I really struggled with, like. I felt like everyone was way better than me, but I think I'm doing better at kind of seeing the positives that I bring to that setting. If that. If that's a goal. [00:19:30] Speaker B: Yeah, that makes a lot of sense. And that. That kind of. Oh, my fidget toy. Just broken. Oh, no, there's like this little, like. Okay, well, I need to put that away, so Thorin. Can't get it. One second there. Okay. [00:19:45] Speaker A: I've got two. You can have one of mine. [00:19:47] Speaker B: Oh, yeah. I want your popcorn, too. If you can give me sherry popcorn and a fidget toy through the screen somehow, that would be fantastic. Jealous. Let me see that bowl. Do you also have that same exact set? No, I also have that. [00:20:05] Speaker A: You have this too. This is like John Lewis, like cheapo. [00:20:08] Speaker B: That's what we have, the John Lewis. [00:20:10] Speaker A: I mean, yeah. Isn't that cheap? [00:20:12] Speaker B: John Lewis isn't cheap, but it's the basic range. We have that as well. [00:20:16] Speaker A: These were the ones I had when I first went to university. So, yeah, in, like, my first year. These were the bowls and plates I had. [00:20:25] Speaker B: Those are the plates. [00:20:26] Speaker A: So we've had the same bowls and plates for how long? [00:20:30] Speaker B: Two sets of them. [00:20:32] Speaker A: That's amazing. [00:20:33] Speaker B: That's so random. Like, how so? For those who are very confused, we realized recently through Laura sending me a picture of her dino nuggets, that we have the same, like, bowls and plates set, which is also John Lewis. [00:20:48] Speaker A: I think you can buy them from John Lewis. [00:20:52] Speaker B: Yes. Yeah. And the exact same color, exact same, like, type. And then Laura's just showed me her other. Another set that she has her popcorn in. And it's also the other one that I. [00:21:04] Speaker A: That's mad, isn't it? [00:21:05] Speaker B: That is really funny. [00:21:06] Speaker A: If fate existed, that. That is fate. [00:21:09] Speaker B: And if fate were going to give us a sign, that would definitely be it. [00:21:12] Speaker A: Yeah, that's it. Definitely. [00:21:16] Speaker B: Oh, I completely forgot what I was saying about. Oh, yeah, you were talking about, like, if. If that even is a goal. And. And, like, that's where we come to, like, the problems with goal setting is, like, what is a goal? And why is a goal? And does a goal have to be measurable? Can you. How do you know? Like, especially with a goal, like, okay, well, I'd like to feel more confident in myself. Or even if you use different language around it, like, I'd like to feel like I'm able to be more myself in various situations. That's still a goal. But how do you measure that? And we'll get to this and Laura will definitely touch on it at the end, but there's various types of goals, and I don't like the almost positivist, which means very. Almost binary. Very. It is what it is approach that a lot of goal literature and approaches have, because it requires you to. To know a lot about what you're doing, which isn't the human experience, because we're always like, but why? You know. [00:22:18] Speaker A: Yes. [00:22:19] Speaker B: Oh, yeah. Did I interrupt you? I feel like you were about to say something. [00:22:22] Speaker A: No, no. I just wanted to say. But why? [00:22:26] Speaker B: Like, that was great. I'm just. For some reason, the way you said that, I feel like there should be like an explosion behind you, like, what happens to me sometimes. And then it got me wondering if anything else happens, if I do like a. No, nothing's happening. [00:22:42] Speaker A: Yes, Hands. [00:22:43] Speaker B: Nothing's happening this time. Oh, no. [00:22:47] Speaker A: How disappointing. [00:22:49] Speaker B: Oh, well, maybe some. It has to be super random. Yeah. So we're gonna talk about a few different types of goals. So the primary ones we look at that are, you know, really researched on a lot are outcome versus process focused goals. But then there's also more open goals, which I think is kind of what Laura was talking about. And honestly my favorite type of goal. But that's also as people that know a lot about goal setting and use these other types of goals in our lives. So I think that's important is really touching on what works for you. And sometimes the easiest place to start is with these more firm kind of like goal types that can be quite directive and help you. So we say New Year's resolutions, but it's really, you know, goal setting for your year. And so I'd like everyone to kind of think about a goal you have. Take a sec to think, okay, Whether it's small or big, whether it's like, okay, I want to save X amount of money by this time. I would like to be able to lift this amount in my, you know, in my deadlifts by July, something like that. I'd like to move to this place by this time. Right. And okay, great, that's a goal. But before we can really delve into kind of how we're going to go about getting there, you have to think about why. So you need to clarify, you know, why am I doing this? Why do I want this? And this can help provide a lot of motivation. It can provide clarity for the how. And so the important thing to recognize is that goals that are really aligned with your own intrinsic motivation, which we've touched on before, which is, you know, the motivation that comes from within you. So it aligns with your personal values, your own growth as a person, and, you know, things that you like. These kind of goals are more sustainable where extrinsic motivations. So these are motivations that are encouraged by like a reward or pressure from outside sources. So I think those are more sustainable. And so I would like everyone to ask yourself, okay, what deeper purpose does this goal serve? Does this money I want to save by this time, you know, give me a holiday? Does it make me feel more secure in the chaos that is, you know, current life and the economy, the housing market, whatever? Do I want to get stronger just because I would like my legs to be a bit bigger or I want to be able to defeat somebody in battle? [00:25:35] Speaker A: Yes, survive an apocalypse. [00:25:38] Speaker B: Yeah, survive apocalypse. You never know. AI is going real quick. So, yeah, do you want to defeat the robot overlords. There are just so many whys. [00:25:49] Speaker A: Oh, my gosh. I never realized that was my why until now. [00:25:56] Speaker B: Sorry. Go for it. No, no, you go. [00:26:02] Speaker A: Do you want to go or should I go? [00:26:03] Speaker B: I would like you to go. [00:26:04] Speaker A: Okay. [00:26:05] Speaker B: Okay. [00:26:06] Speaker A: Don't forget what you were going to say, though. [00:26:07] Speaker B: I did already. That's why I want you to go. So I was going to say, like. [00:26:11] Speaker A: As you were talking about, like, understanding your why, I was thinking a lot about, you know, like, I think we're all probably like guilty of this. In kind of New Year's resolutions, we want to, like, you know, lose weight, for example. And I feel like that can often be something that's very external. It's like. Well, actually I feel like I should because maybe that's just what people do in the new year, or this is kind of what society perhaps expects or whatever. But actually, why are you doing that? Is that something that you actually want to do or is it just something that society has put on you or external pressure from whoever it might be? And I think with that as well, you know, if you do kind of say, want to be healthier, then it is asking that, why do you want to, like, what will that allow you to do in your life that perhaps you can't at the moment? Because I do think that with goals we are often sacrificing something else, you know, So I think we have to have a good. Yeah, A good purpose behind it that allows us to, like you say, that allows it to be sustainable. And it's not just something we do for a couple of weeks and then we realize, actually, I don't want to sacrifice. For example, enjoying certain foods, like, that might just not be worth it. [00:27:31] Speaker B: Yeah, you don't want to give up those dino nuggets. That would be terrible. [00:27:35] Speaker A: I'm not giving them up. [00:27:36] Speaker B: You're like, I don't care what my goal is. Those are remaining in my life. [00:27:39] Speaker A: I think they are actually quite good for you. But not that that really matters. I would still eat them. Mayonnaise is one. I only recently gave up full fat mayonnaise for light mayonnaise. [00:27:50] Speaker B: But I thought full fat stuff was healthier because they replace the fat with like sugar and stuff. [00:27:57] Speaker A: So maybe I need to go back. [00:27:59] Speaker B: Just do whatever you want, basically. [00:28:02] Speaker A: Do what makes you happy. [00:28:03] Speaker B: How to set a goal. Do whatever you want. Pure hedonism. [00:28:07] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:28:08] Speaker B: Demonic well being, only without any psychological well being. That's such a good point though, because I think that's something that often gets overlooked. There's a reason why we have to do goal setting if we want to. Like, if you want to approach a goal because it does require sacrifice. No matter what it is, there's a reason it's not just happening. You know, you have to likely give something up. Even if it's something as like, oh, I would like to develop these muscles more. Well, you're going to either sacrifice another muscle group or sacrifice more time to the gym, eat more protein. So whatever kind of thing you're looking at, there will be some measure of that. And so I think just acknowledging that alone is a really important step that I often miss, and I, I'm assuming a lot of people often miss, is acknowledging that there is sacrifice involved in goal setting, no matter how small. And probably the larger the goal, the larger the sacrifice. I mean, we're looking at elite athletes who have their goal settings. If we're talking about Olympians, their goal setting spans. Well, it's split up into various different times, but eight years down to four years, and that four years is split up year by year into much smaller things that they have to be involved in constantly. But they're sacrificing social lives, you know, having a drink over Christmas, meals. There's the, the sacrifice, you know, the, the pain, the physical and mental pain that goes into it. So I think that's something to definitely kind of keep in mind. [00:29:38] Speaker A: Yeah. And I think what's interesting, you can also have it kind of the other way. So I've worked with, and you probably have as well, but like working with, well, athletes and just people in general. Right. If we want to actually add more self care into what we're doing and look after ourselves more, allow ourselves more rest, there still can be a lot of sacrifice involved in that too. Because it can feel so uncomfortable sometimes to, you know, not go and do that gym session that day or to not do that bit of work that you feel like you should do and actually to look after yourself and allow yourself to rest. So I think that can still feel like a sacrifice, even though it's more of a self care angle. [00:30:17] Speaker B: No, I totally agree, but I disagree that it's going the other way. I think see it as the same direction because it's still a sacrifice of what's comfortable to you. And so you're still sacrificing your psychological comfort. You're sacrificing, you might feel guilt. That's a huge sacrifice if you have to feel guilt. If you, you know, things like that. There's a lot going on in Terms of sacrifice there. Yeah. [00:30:42] Speaker A: And I think that is why sometimes like sticking to goals can be so difficult because it is, it's kind of, it's a shift I guess from our norm and it is a shift from a shift into like feeling uncomfortable and doing something that is a bit different. [00:31:01] Speaker B: Yeah, yeah. And that comfort is what we're evolved to seek for a reason. So, you know, so I think, okay, on that note, I'll get into outcome, outcome based goals. So we've got outcome, process and open goals. And so I'm going to build from what we almost kind of dislike versus like the most though all of them are useful in their own ways. So an outcome based goal is a goal that focuses on a very specific result or achievement that you want. And so they define the what of what you aim to accomplish but don't really specify how. They don't say how am I going to get to this destination? They point out what the destination is. So while it can give you a clear vision of what success looks like, there's no like, okay, what are we doing? So when we going back to what the examples I was giving, it's okay, I want to gain X amount of money by June. I want to graduate with this grade or this mark. I want to get a promotion by the end of the year. So while this can provide direction and a little bit of clarity because obviously if you know, you need to know where you're going, there are some challenges. So there's a lack of control. So external factors can really influence your success. So if you're talking about saving a certain amount of money, things like market trends and elections and things like that will impact that. There's a lot of pressure and stress that can be involved in these outcome paced goals because if you're only focusing on the result, this can create a lot of anxiety especially you know, with setbacks that occur and especially if this process is happening slower than you would have liked and you can't really figure out the why behind it. The but why. And as, as Laura and I talk about in almost probably every episode you, the process of life is so important and in these outcome only goals you start to neglect this process. And so if this focus is entirely on the end result, you might overlook. Look, building those sustainable habits, you know, learning from the journey and just being present with yourself on that journey which you know, we've linked to well being, we've linked to mental health, we've linked it to psych safety and just learning overall. And then lastly there's this risk of kind of what we talked touched on a little bit earlier of all or nothing thinking. While sometimes this like very binary thinking can be helpful and is a very neurological thing, sometimes this kind of societally influenced and enforced binary thinking, either like, we've achieved the goal or we've not achieved the goal, things like that can be really harmful. So it can lead to discouragement if you didn't fully realize your goal or do it on time. So, for example, I've got a PhD student who wanted to submit. She was really adamant that she wanted to submit one of her papers by end of August or September. And it was her first one. And so, you know, not being fully aware of what the process entails and the amount of work it takes to get a paper ready for publication. All those tiny, tiny little details, like, you know, the making sure tables are perfect, making sure there's not a single mistake. And at first that, you know, really was a massive setback, like emotionally for her because she was like, I. It's just so frustrating because you have the certain timeline in your head, but it didn't happen. And it's almost like, well, now what? What's the point? And it takes, you know, people to go, oh, this is normal. I totally get where you're coming from. It sucks here to support that kind of vibe. [00:34:41] Speaker A: Yeah. And I think that just reinforces this importance of like having to have some sort of flexibility with your goals. Because when we. They can seem quite, well, very specific and they should be specific, which we'll go into a little bit kind of later. But I think there is also it is a real skill to be able to be flexible with them when things change. And I think one of the things that helps with that is yeah, if you are working towards a certain goal, but perhaps you miss it, whether it is a deadline. So maybe we missed the goal, but actually what else have we gotten from again that process? Like, was I living by my why or by like my values and what was important and have I learned something and is actually something that I can get out of this process as well. So sometimes it can be tough if we almost don't have anything else to fall back on apart from that very outcome focused goal. [00:35:43] Speaker B: You know, Laura, 30 has made you so wise. [00:35:47] Speaker A: Thank you so much. [00:35:49] Speaker B: The I just loved what you said about how bouncing back from maybe not accomplishing a specific or like being flexible with your goals is a real skill because that's so right. And often another thing that gets really overlooked because so goal setting and accomplishment is A skill that you work towards acquiring. It's not something that you can just do. And that's why we like to start with small goals or goals that you can accomplish through outcome or even what we're going to talk about next, process based goal setting. And it's just a skill. And the better you get at goal setting, the better you get at accomplishing your goals and the more successful you are, whether that your goals are in terms of health, well being, finances, career, stuff like that. So you wizened lady. [00:36:37] Speaker A: Oh, thanks. I've learned something in my 30 years. [00:36:44] Speaker B: Just continuing to get more and more wise, but kind of in line with what Laura was saying. I'll move on to process based goals. So these are goals that are focused on kind of what we were talking about before and other episodes, the actions, the habits or behaviors that require you to achieve this desired outcome. So I want Y, but what are the X's that get to that in the first place? So these goals emphasize what you do, so the process and not what you're achieving. So there's way more focus. While there is a end focus on what you want to achieve, that's not the whole focus. So it almost takes away some of that importance on that final goal. And they're very actionable, controllable, within your immediate influence. And so firstly they're essential to accomplishing your goal, but secondly, it gives you a greater source of autonomy over your own life and sense of smaller achievements along the way. So did you have anything to check in before I go into why they work now? [00:37:52] Speaker A: You go into that first and then I'll say, well, I'm thinking if you're. [00:37:57] Speaker B: Not watching on YouTube, you're missing out because she did a lovely little like top hat like as if or like thought leaving your brain. I don't know. [00:38:05] Speaker A: Yeah, that was my thought process. That was my brain talking. [00:38:08] Speaker B: To me it looked like you were like taking your top off. So process based goals work especially much more than outcome based goals because they activate that sense of agency by keeping on the focus on what you can control. So they provide frequent reinforcement through the small, more consistent wins which boost, boost motivation. And so let's say again going with the gym metaphor apparently that I can't myself get rid of if we're looking to get to, you know, X personal best on our deadlift and say we, we want to break that down into to smaller bits. So if we want to get to this by June, maybe by February, I've increased my load by you know, 5 to 6 pounds then maybe by like another 10, maybe by another XYZ. And as long you've got those smaller, shorter deadlines to accomplish accomplish smaller, shorter goals and along the way you feel great about it and you also have that sense of control. And what this also does is it builds habits to do this for yourself and to kind of make these incremental changes instead of massive ones. And importantly from like that psychological and also well being vibe is it just allows us to be very human and enjoy the experience as a whole. Because if you think back to our evolution, most of our goals, and this is probably why we do this naturally, are very outcome based. Okay, we need to eat, we need to, you know, drink and we don't. Didn't think a lot about the process because that was just kind of more instinct than anything else. Whereas now we have goals that do, they do, but there's some that don't align with kind of those evolutionary needs. There's a lot more thought that needs to go into it. So overall, if you like are committing to the process and these process based goals, you set yourself up for much more long term success while also maintaining a healthier, more sustainable relationship with goal setting and achievement more broadly. So it just makes it a better process but also more useful and effective for you. [00:40:22] Speaker A: Yeah, and I was reflecting on your, your gym thing. So I recently started going to gym maybe like, I don't know, maybe like four months ago now. And I initially hated it because it was like very strange and seemed like. [00:40:34] Speaker B: Because it was strange I felt like. [00:40:37] Speaker A: I was in like a zoo or something. Do you know what I mean? Like, didn't feel like natural but I actually really like it now. But I am not the sort of person who would be like, okay, I want to lift this much more or that much more. I kind of like to go in and just sort of like feel, feel it and just like, I don't know, just kind of. I, yeah, I suppose kind of just put it to where I feel I am like that day. But I think that I was kind of thinking about my goals. I feel like mine are almost more like, you know, today I'm gonna go on like a new machine or I'm going to just try something different or kind of be brave in that way. And actually for me to do that I recognize that I need to almost like be accepting that I'm going to put this on quite a low weight because I just want to see what it feels like. So I think it's for people also kind of reflecting on where they feel they're at with a certain goal. And it might. Sometimes it seems kind of simple, but it could literally be, I'm just going to go and try that for five minutes, maybe like thinking about weight. But it's actually, it's still that actionable. It's still kind of what are we controlling in that scenario? But it can be brave and take courage just to take that first step of trying something new. [00:41:58] Speaker B: Absolutely. And, and putting on my psychologist hat listening to that, I was thinking, so is your goal to be brave and this is a step that you're taking to, to kind of be brave in that gym in this new and newer environment? Because you hadn't said, okay, my goal is to get stronger. You hadn't said, my goal is to do xyz. It's just like, okay, is her goal to be brave? And that's what we're talking about is like a goal doesn't have to be that measurable. It's like, I would like to be braver each day and now I'm being brave by trying a different machine. But then like you said, there's so many other factors that require you to maybe feel more vulnerable or, you know, a number of other emotions or think a lot of other thoughts that really go into it. So that was just really interesting. [00:42:45] Speaker A: Yeah. Yeah. And I think another thing as well that I was thinking about was something I talk to like my clients about is trying to stay away from like emotion focused goals. So stay away from like, oh, I want to feel. [00:42:59] Speaker B: Oh, sorry, this episode's dog interruptions. [00:43:06] Speaker A: I think I literally just jumped. [00:43:08] Speaker B: I was like, oh my gosh. [00:43:12] Speaker A: Stanley. [00:43:14] Speaker B: He'S not barging in today. [00:43:17] Speaker A: No, I've got my barrier up. But yeah, so not setting emotion focused goals of I want to feel less anxious, but keeping them really actionable, like you were saying. So keeping it more. Yeah. Based on a behavior that we control because it's really hard for us to control how we might feel. So I might want to go and try out a new machine at the gym. I feel kind of nervous about it, but that doesn't necessarily have to stop me from. From doing the action. [00:43:46] Speaker B: Definitely. Yeah. I love that that's such a good explanation of something that's actually quite big long term. If you take those long, like those long, those short steps and building up and accomplishing maybe an overall goal. Like, but were you aware that you had that goal or is that something that you've maybe realized more recently? [00:44:09] Speaker A: A goal of like being more, More brave? [00:44:12] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:44:17] Speaker A: Maybe more Recently, I think. I don't know, maybe as I. I think initially when I went in the gym I was really nervous, like, do like the weights and stuff. But then I was like, I'm just gonna try and see what happens and it'll be okay. And then I also got help from one of my friends, so she would come into the gym with me and help me do like the squats things. So. So I was way too afraid to go on that on my own. But actually having a friend come with me and show me how to do it made me feel more comfortable to do it on my own. So that was also kind of helpful, I think, especially with things like that, where it might be like, I was kind of like, I don't want to hurt myself. [00:44:57] Speaker B: Yeah, fair. [00:45:00] Speaker A: So. And I. Yeah, I think it's interesting as well that sometimes it can feel uncomfortable to like ask for help if we need it. So I think remembering, like, if you are setting goals, that doesn't have to be something that you're just working through on your own. Like think about if there are people around you that can help you move towards what you want to achieve. [00:45:19] Speaker B: Definitely. And they don't even have to be aware. They can be aware if you need, if you need somebody to like keep, you know, keep track or you know, help you, you know, do things and you want to let them, them know, great. But if you're just like, okay, well, I know this person's going to support me and they want to come to the gym, little, little do they know they're going to really help me gain confidence in this area. [00:45:40] Speaker A: Yeah, exactly. [00:45:43] Speaker B: Oh, gosh. So, you know, how do we do this? How are we going to use a process based goal? What we use a lot in sport, which, you know, has some positives and some negatives, but really I'm going to introduce it as something that you can introduce into your life as a good starting place. It's called the smart framework. So smart for specific, measurable, achievable, relevant, time bound. And so when we're looking at this for specific, we want to know what the end goal is. A very clear goal. So if the goal is I want to exercise more, that's not really enough because that's not very specific. So I want to walk 30 minutes, five days a week is maybe like the goal that you want, you want it to be measurable. So quantify the progress to stay motivated. This walking metaphor maybe doesn't work for everyone, but say you had an injury like an ACL tear or something. Like that and whatever it is that made it so that you weren't able to walk 30 minutes in a row at once. So then you would go, okay, so for the first month I want to get up to walking for 10 minutes five days a week and then I want to get up to walking, you know, 15 minutes two days a week and then 10 minutes the other. So breaking it down, making it very measurable so that you know, you can check that off achievable. So set very realistic goals so you can avoid that burnout we've talked about. You can avoid being let, feeling let down, avoid feelings of guilt that are likely to make you just say, nah, that's not for me relevant. So ensure this aligns with your priorities, your values, you know, any number of, I know areas that would that make sense for you. Because if it just completely doesn't fit within your life or you as a person, you've got no chance and it's pointless. And then finally time bound. So if this is something, so this is something that Laura and I don't necessarily always like, but there are times that you need, you know, a time bound goal. So if you are an athlete, say from our area of expertise and you've got the Olympics, these are very time bound goals. So you have to maybe set a timeline about when you're going to be accomplishing these smaller goals to reach this larger goal. And that creates that sense of urgency and motivation. So overall these kind of provide some structure. It reduces a bit of the uncertainty surrounding goal setting and it can, if done right, increase motivation. If done wrong and not fit into your life and your personality, your values, etc. It can, you know, decrease motivation. So again, as we say about basically everything, the important part is to fit it into your life. So yeah. Laura, did you have anything to say about smart goals? Because I know you and I have a lot of thoughts. There's great times to use them and I think sometimes New Year's resolutions are good times and then sometimes there's like not so great times. [00:48:48] Speaker A: Yeah. And I think as you were speaking, I was thinking how important it is to go back to this, the kind of achievable part of the smart goals and almost like reflecting a bit to yourself, like, okay, is this realistic? Have I shot too high? Is it too easy? And then actually kind of changing that and adapting it as you go. So once you've set the goal, it's not like that's then it done and you've got to stick to it. But I think go Back to it and think, okay, is this working? Is it not working? And is there a part of this that I need to adjust? So, like you say, it does fit with me and my life. [00:49:26] Speaker B: I think that's where the SMART framework is really useful because it almost forces you to take note of all these different factors consistently. And so if you're not accomplishing X, Y, Z by the timeline you set for yourself, it almost forces you to almost re approach how you're doing your goal. And I think that's where it can be really useful. As long as you're not somebody or you're not in a place or you don't have these outside pressures on you that can make you feel bad as long as you look at it from that realistic point of view, like you said, is, okay, well, here's the problem with how we initially laid out the goal process, and we've learned from it. And so the next however many months or years to achieve this goal, we're going to alter this accordingly. And from so on and so forth. So I think we'll go into kind of how to maximize resolutions. So again, it's focusing on that process, I think that's really important, and being flexible. So I think focusing on that humanity aspect that Laura and I keep trying to drill into everything we do. We live in a world that, you know, both us for our work, but also people overall. It tries to kind of suck that humanity out of you, but that just doesn't work because we are human beings. So make sure that you're focused on that process. Make sure that, you know, you're thinking about what you're doing and feeling what you're doing. And also be flexible because we are humans and there's no such thing as perfect. And so I think that's, you know, as always, the important bit. Did you have to chuck in? Yeah. [00:50:59] Speaker A: Yes. There's something that I like, so something that I have often been in discussions with people about, but is. And actually it's more to do with, like, the idea of, like, weight loss. Right. And I think there is still a bit of a perception that say, to lose weight, we need to almost, like, feel ashamed of ourselves. And that's going to, like, motivate us to kind of lose weight. But actually there's this acceptance is much more powerful. So we need to accept where we're at. And I think I was thinking about this because of that humanity element. And actually, yeah, being. Accepting that. Yeah. Accepting of ourselves where we are right now, and that actually helps us to change More than if we are shaming ourselves into not being able to achieve what we want or what somebody else expects. Factors too. So I, Yeah, that humanity element. And I think accepting ourselves for where we are right now, even before we make a change is really important, but it is really difficult. Oh, that's like an important part of the process. [00:52:04] Speaker B: It's tough because that acceptance part is just so complicated because first you need that much self awareness to know and that itself is a process. And it's just like, it's just so difficult. It's not obviously impossible, but you know, it's, It's. We become more self aware and accepting of ourselves as time goes on. Hopefully. Yeah, we should, as long as we're attempting to. So just keep an open mind, you know, try and be flexible, try and be human, try be self aware. And then you can kind of accept where you are at each point in that goal setting process. I think, I think that's. And I think that kind of goes in line with, okay, we'll track that goal setting process so that you can be flexible but also celebrate those small wins. So recognize and reward milestones to sustain that momentum. Just like we're doing a little celebratory episode 10, like in the broad scheme of podcasts. That's not very many episodes, but we're happy about it. [00:53:03] Speaker A: Yes. [00:53:04] Speaker B: So I think, yeah, that's my little thing about the smart framework, which can be useful. I will never say that it will always be useful, but Laura, I think wanted to chat through open goals a bit, which are like almost the next stage in the evolution of goals, I suppose. [00:53:24] Speaker A: Yeah. And I think kind of to start with when, say, for example, if you are thinking about breaking down a goal for the first time, I think this is where smart goals comes in really useful because it provides a bit more of a structured framework, but for some people, that you might not like it kind of that structured. You might want a bit more flexibility in there. Or even just for some circumstances, it might not be appropriate to have a really kind of structured goal like that. So open goals are something which are less specific and more exploratory. Exploratory, Is that how you say it? [00:54:04] Speaker B: I mean, you're asking the wrong person. My accent's so weird now after living in the uk. Exploratory. I don't know what it is. [00:54:11] Speaker A: Yeah, exploratory. So they are. They're more like that. So I really like these, but I think sometimes I struggle with things that feel quite rigid and I think I like to kind of shift a bit more kind of in the moment. So, yeah, so it's kind of more open and might even be things that are just kind of coming to mind with you on like a certain day, for example. But I think another thing I quite like, which I think links more to open goals, is almost having a bit of an ABC framework where we might have, say, our goal A is that we want to achieve X, say in a race. But then actually if we can't meet that, then it might be B, like a goal B and then a goal C. So even if we're not meeting what we want, we can still be flexible and we can still kind of work towards what we want. So I think there are ways that we can build more flexibility into goals. If actually the rigidity of them kind. [00:55:19] Speaker B: Of puts you off, that makes a lot of sense. And when you were talking about the open goals, I think that those are really important for humans in general. It depends on what you're trying to accomplish, you know what I mean? So I think if you have a really concrete goal that you need to accomplish within a specific framework or that you want to accomplish within a specific, like time framework, great. But if you're talking about more broader development as a person, I think that's where open goals are really good. Now that can be physical, mental, financial, etc. Etc. But I really do think that, say, like, my goal to be was generally to be once after my autism diagnosis, my goal was to generally be more accepting of myself and advocating for myself. And I didn't really break this down in terms of, okay, how am I going to accomplish this in a certain amount of time. I just thought about, okay, what are some small ways I can do this? And one of them was that we talked about in our last episode, which was around boundaries with technology and things like that. I know I've talked to you about this before, Laura, but I just randomly had an idea one day where I was like, okay, one idea to give me more rest and set some boundaries was to just take a week off and sit alone with myself. And all these things went towards my goal. But even if you took them to somebody who really likes these really strict kind of goal setting vibes, they would be like, wow, that is pure chaos. But I knew that they were all in line with what I actually did want to accomplish in the end. So I guess that's why the why is so important. So I know what I wanted and I knew why. And so if something popped into my head, I was able to go okay, well, this is congruent with my aims. And it wasn't even like a solid, like a measurable aim, really. [00:57:26] Speaker A: And that could feel so freeing to be like, okay, I've got kind of a rough direction that I want to move in, but I haven't necessarily set what that end goal is. But I think even just having that direction of, okay, I want to rest and just kind of seeing where that takes you, I think that can be really powerful in itself. We don't always need to have an end goal. We can just have a direction that we want to move in. And I think, as well, with open goals, I think it's really interesting that even in, I suppose, more performance areas that we see that open goals or goals which are to do your best, for example, can actually bring you higher levels of flow than if you have a really specific goal. Yeah. [00:58:16] Speaker B: That just makes me think about what we talked about last episode with if you have very literal thinking, and if your goal is to do your best, then you're just doing your best 100% of the time, no matter what. But that's what we mean about taking into account your own personal variables. Like, because I'm so literal, I would have to say do your best within these hours for the specific role, not do best all the time. You know what I mean? [00:58:42] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:58:42] Speaker B: So it's just being so personal about it. [00:58:45] Speaker A: Yeah. And I think I maybe see that kind of do your best goal. I quite like. So I play a lot of tennis, and I quite like that for me and tennis. I wouldn't say I ever go into a tennis match with a goal of, like, I want to hit this many first serves or whatever, but I will always go in, like, with a very open goal of that I just want to enjoy it, or that I want to. Yeah. Still kind of work hard and do my best, but I'm not necessarily giving myself the parameters around that. [00:59:15] Speaker B: I like that and I like how that works for you. Because if I do that, like, say, with volleyball, if I say, do your best, then if I make a mistake, then I'm just pissed because that wasn't the best game I could have. [00:59:28] Speaker A: So I think that's why it's got to be coupled with also enjoy yourself. Yes. [00:59:32] Speaker B: Yes. [00:59:34] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah. [00:59:35] Speaker B: But the issue is I only enjoy myself if I'm doing my best, Laura. And that means that it has to be perfect. [00:59:43] Speaker A: Okay, Yeah, I see what you mean. We need to enter a less competitive league for that to work. [00:59:49] Speaker B: See, then I can't do that because then that will just really piss me off. I, I honestly I've become considered going into like. So basically what I've done is to transfer to sports where I'm not like, haven't been like a quote unquote expert. Then I'm fine. But when you've been at that level, you can't. It's for me personally, it just does not work. No volleyball goals for Kristen. [01:00:11] Speaker A: Fair enough. Maybe. Yeah, avoid those goals. [01:00:14] Speaker B: Yeah, my goal is to avoid playing volleyball and I have succeeded for years. Oh gosh. [01:00:26] Speaker A: So maybe, well, maybe should we, should we do some reflections to. To end? Yes. So we were kind of thinking some good things to reflect on might be around firstly, like what, what goals fit in with your why? So can you identify what your why is and then kind of what goals might align with that and also think about what type of goal setting works best for you. So are you one of these people who will thrive more off having more of a framework, like the smart goals framework, or do you think you're better with a bit more flexibility with more of an open goal? So yeah, have a reflect on them and then maybe consider that when you're setting some New Year's resolutions. [01:01:07] Speaker B: Yes, I love those reflective questions and I will definitely be asking them to myself and forcing Jack to answer them as well. So thank you guys for listening. As usual, we probably have more questions than answers, but we really enjoyed exploring goal setting slash New Year's resolutions. Do you have any questions? Make sure to comment and let us know. We'd also love to know if you have any topics you'd like us to explore. So please get in touch. Make sure to like follow, engage however your platform allows and tell your friends. Any engagement from you guys on literally any platform really helps us so that you know we always appreciate it. And honestly, we just love hearing from people what their thoughts and feedback are. You can find us on very social various social media platforms. The link is in our bio of our but why Instagram page and in the show notes. And remember, the first step to understanding is asking but why? Stay tuned for episode two or what is it Part two of our Christmas party. [01:02:10] Speaker A: Yay. Goodbye.